2 way Danley Synergy build

[NBPK402]

The carpenter told me he used a finish that is used for hardwood floors... I love it as it is a mirror finish.

 

[NBPK402]

Stunning, beautiful and amazing... I hope they sound stunning, beautiful and amazing... Lol... And you didn't fill them with activated carbon...

I might try some Roxul in the cabinet this time. I had the cabinet made out of 1" this time, with the front baffle1 1/2".

 

[NBPK402]

I finished assembling the center channel today. I made a wiring harness for the center also that is close to the same as the left and right channel harnesses. I took a picture of the harness in the speaker, but forgot to get a pic of it with the Roxul in the cabinet. I would take the back off again to take a pic, but the rear panel is very close fitting and I do not want to chance damaging it as I already got 2 scratches on the side when I was moving the speaker on the carpet. Apparently there was a couple of kitty litter granules and they dug 2 big scratches in it. My carpenter said he can fix it, but it will be inside of the rack and not seen so I will leave it for now. I also put dynamat on the horn to dampen the horn a bit (no pic of that either).
The 2nd pic us the speaker cable I made for the center channel.

 

[chrapladm]

Progress progress. Look forward in your testing results. PLUS nice to learn from your thread before I start mine.

 

[NBPK402]

What are you going to build?

 

[chrapladm]

What are you going to build?

I am wanting to build a synergy horn using the TPL200, Clestion mids and either six 10's or pair of 15's. I was looking at build something with a similar footprint as the J7 from Danley. I maybe limited with the height of my cabinet because the TPL's vertical dispersion but I will see what I can do. I will go with an 80 x 30 setup.

Lots of variables but I love the TPL sound. If I knew how I would make a TPL combiner with the mids and build the SH. Then I could have my footprint that I want. I will be building three of them so who knows. One maybe a center channel that is wide and the others are vertical. My projects take forever but things are finally turning around for me so projects are going to finally begin.

 

[NBPK402]

I am wanting to build a synergy horn using the TPL200, Clestion mids and either six 10's or pair of 15's. I was looking at build something with a similar footprint as the J7 from Danley. I maybe limited with the height of my cabinet because the TPL's vertical dispersion but I will see what I can do. I will go with an 80 x 30 setup.

Lots of variables but I love the TPL sound. If I knew how I would make a TPL combiner with the mids and build the SH. Then I could have my footprint that I want. I will be building three of them so who knows. One maybe a center channel that is wide and the others are vertical. My projects take forever but things are finally turning around for me so projects are going to finally begin.

Stay tuned... I will be starting another pair that will be made from bendable plywood and mdf. This pair will be modeled off of the short side of the horn and will be a square synergy horn. It will be 25" x25" x the sane depth as my current ones.

 

[NBPK402]

I spent a little time today, and I have all the angles required to make 1 side of the new square synergy horn. The 1st one will be out of bendable plywood and 3/4" MDF. I think I will recess the woofer rings ( I will make it wide enough of a recess to account for the surrounds not hitting too) into the side of the horn so the woofer will be closer to the horn., and also give me a way to mount the horns with studs. I am thinking 1/8" -1/4" recess with 1/8" being pretty close to the thickness of one of my horns (the thickness varies from 1 horn to another). With the mdf the pieces can all be glued and clamped to the bendable plywood once I make new longer pieces for the the actual horn (today wss just to figure out the angles to use to conform to the original the best I could). I will also try one with MDF connected with biscuits, and if it works out...the plan is to make the horn out of solid wood. I am attaching a pic of what it looks like on the horn mockup. It looks flat in the picture, but it is conforming to the short side of the horn pretty nicely.

 

[NBPK402]

How does impulse response and phase response affect the sound of speakers? I am thinking impulse is dynamics, and phase is soundstage...am I right or is there more to it?

 

[NBPK402]

Final tune is now done.Sounds great! Next is to get the other amp built for the surrounds,
heights, and then the smaller square versions of these out of wood.
As you can see I have null for the center. I think it is because of the depth of the room, and I cannot put any panels in my wifes kitchen or on the front door. I only have 2 bass traps on the front corners. When I can get some fabric for more panels, I plan on covering the concrete portions of the front wall with panels. Once that is done I will try some side wall panels too.

 

[NBPK402]

I just got one of the plates installed.

 

[Kakkadu]

How does impulse response and phase response affect the sound of speakers? I am thinking impulse is dynamics, and phase is soundstage...am I right or is there more to it?

You're partially correct. The impulse response affects some of the dynamics but does not reflect it. Electrostatic panels have an excellent impulse response but they're not perceived as too dynamic speakers (their dynamic sound exists in the upper frequency though). The speaker phase hasn't been perceived as critical in controlled ABX tests but it's important that whatever the phase is, it's symmetrical on both channels. Personally I've found that there is some difference when the phase is flat but analytical data does not support my personal experience.

 

[NBPK402]

Well it has been a whi,e since I posted up anything on my next project... a smaller all wood version of
my big boys. Post number 83 shows the template piece I made to determine the contour and is talked about first in this post.

I started by cutting a piece of 1/8" plywood and attached it to the short side of the k402 horn. Next I cut pieces of mdf at differnt angles and laid them on the 1/8" plywood to match the contour of the horn. Once I was done with that I took the individual piece of MDF and glued them to the plywood on 3 sides, and clamped them to the plywood and horn. Once that was done I went to a friend and he trued up the pieces the wood store had cut for me. The final cut size was 23 1/4" x 21". He then showed me how to cut a kerf and then cut a kerf 1" from the edge. Next I cut a kerf every 1/2" until I had 13 kerfs per piece. I am using 3/8" Birch plywood, and I cut kerfs down to about 1 1/2 ply...I think it is 8 ply plywood. (Layers per thickness of ply). Then my friend cut me 3 pieces of wood (matching the contour I had made earlier) for the jig. I put the jig together yesterday and today I did a trial assembly of 1 side of the horn. Next I plan on getting the grooves filled with bondo... I am planning on placing it on the k402 short side and tracing the horn so I can trace one piece for cutting.. Each horn will be comprised of 2 pieces cut to the contour of the horn, and 2 will be 23 1/4" x 21". All 4 pieces are kerfed and the 15" woofers will be attached to the 23 1/4" x 21" pieces.

I am not quite sure how I should get them to fit together properly... I am thinking of making a simple frame the size of the horn mouth and then making a 2" x 2" piece of wood for the horn throat. I would also make a piece of wood bigger than the horn mouth to attach the mouth frame too, and in the center of the mouth attach a piece of wood or metal rod that would hold the 2"x2" piece for aligning the throat end of the horn.

I am still contemplating making it 2 layers thick for ease of assembly with the outside layer being MDF that is veneered on each side...not sure yet though.
How does that sound? Suggestions?

Pics are of the jig with ine side in place awaiting bondo for the grooves.

 

[NBPK402]

I went to my friends shop again and since I now know more about how to make a jig...I had him make them on his CNC. Now I will have 2 forming jigs that are identical, and one jig for setting the cuts for the 2 curved side panels. Hopefully in the next couple of weeks we will be assembling rhe 1st one.

 

[chrapladm]

Look forward in seeing your jigs. Will hopefully give me some inspiration and ideas for my own.

 

[ddude003]

After gaining all this woodworking experience, is there a JBL Paragon build in your future?

 

[NBPK402]

After gaining all this woodworking experience, is there a JBL Paragon build in your future?

Nope...this is my finale build, except for possibly a sub build below each Mini MEH.

 

[NBPK402]

Just picked out my woofers for the new Mini MEHs....
Celestion ftr15-3070e.

I have 4 coming so I can test them out with 4 woofers and with 2 woofers. I am hoping this will bring up my 20hz spl.
I am thinking there will be a 3db increase from spec for running a 2nd woofer and another 3db for running 4 woofers...plus 12db corner loading close to 2 walls.

My last measurement with 2 kappa 15Cs is in pic #1... with Pic #2 showing factory spec for 1 kappa 15c. Pic #3 shows factory spec for 1 Celestion. In addition the impedance around the lower frequencies is much lower...so I am assuming my amp will be able to drive it easier.

Does that sound right?

 

[NBPK402]

I forgot all about my old build...how the update has changed the look, and next month it will change again.I have never had a speaker as long as this one, and change it as much as this one.

 

[Sonnie Parker]

How do you like the sound thus far?

 

[NBPK402]

How do you like the sound thus far?

I really love the sound, but I keep yearning to see if I can eek a little more out of them, and also make them look more like something that is not like the usual look in a speaker setup. As soon as the new custom stands are made (which will put them in a vertical position, like I had before...but retain the box less design), I am going to try a fresh 2 way tune mic'd at 1 meter, and tune the sub horns again individually. Then I am going to tune as a whole from the MLP with my minidsp Dirac Live. We are also starting soon on the smaller center wood version and finish the 2nd pair of k402 MEHs for surrounds. The surrounds will be the same as the front including the stand...except they will have my old EV DH1As and no bass horn.

 

[chrapladm]

Any more updates on this amazing build?

 

[NBPK402]

Thanks for reminding me! I had a lung scare earlier this year due to me having trouble breathing and a person telling me my lung lumps were back.. I went to another lung specialist, and they said there were no lung lumps anymore. At the same time my wife discovered she had a tumor close to her eye,, and had that removed.. So we have both been taking it easy lately.. My wife will be having a follow up exam around the end of the year and getting everything finished up.. I have plenty of upgrades since the last images (most were done earlier this year, but a few have been completed in the last month)... tri-amped with Fosi v3 monoblocks, xangsane 6008ag cables from the xilica to the drivers, including some of the power cables ( rest of the power cables should be completed this month).

The biggest change was double stacking the horns by far. The bottom horn doesn't get a compression driver, and is temporarily plugged with duct tape. I plan on getting a piece of Mesquite cut to plug the hole.
The sound after retuning with REW, and Magic Beans software was very significant. What I now have exceeds what I had in my old Negatron HT.

The midrange and top end are now very open sounding with much more detail, and the mids have a significant amount of clarity and impact compared to what it was with one pair of horns. Magic Beans software took it to the next level, and my imaging is superb now (I thought it was perfect before, but the increased clarity and Magic beans question it much better). The silence between notes is much better since I moved from the Icepower amps to the Fosi too. How much better technology has gotten over the last 10 years!

Now as I have posted before... I was not much of a believer in wire making much of a differnce in the sound, but I have found it has (I still believe it is inductance, resistance, and capacitance, and just good parts). I had amazon cables to start, and then purchased some Chinese clones (or back door sale?), and I saw nice improvements. More air and a more of a 3d soundstage (just from the cables). So I decided to try some other cables, and heard differences in each cable, but when I purchase a Chinese hi-end XLR (Xangsane 6008ag) cable I saw immediate differences in spl, and clarity in the midbass (that was the only speaker I had the xlr hooked up to). I then slowly started to replace all the cables from the Xilica to the drivers with the same brand of cable. The cable is not real expensive but is more than Amazon cables. The most recent picture from the side shows the Xangsane cable (the green cable). I am going to rewire the woofers to a bottom to top cable flow instead of a left to right cable flow, and by doing this I will save 1 pr of 1.5m speaker cable after both channels are completed. This will give me a pair of cables for my center channel when it gets built the beginning of next year.

In the last picture you can see a roll of cable...that is prepped to see if I like that better on the comp drivers...the rest of the cables are all locked in for Xangsane. When I reroute the wiring bottom to top the cable lengths will be more frugal and equal, so no excess cable laying on the floor for the bottom horn and a proper length for the top horn, plus all the connecting woofers will have the same cable.

 

[chrapladm]

Sure beats my synergy horn. LOL You know the one thats still sitting in pieces in boxes because I havent started it yet.

 

[AceOfBase]

That build is a work of art, too rich for my intelligence, but perhaps the more time I spend on this website the more educated I become