2 channel Receiver with separate A and B toggles and Internet Radio and a pair of speakers

[Sonnie Parker]

We have a Denon receiver in our sunroom... very old, but it has served us well. It powers a pair of B&W 600 series speakers in the sunroom that we purchased back in 1994 - yep... 30 years ago. The Denon also powers a pair of Klipsch Synergy outdoor speakers that still do pretty well. Angie listens to FM radio during football season because she will not watch Bama football on TV - she always listens in the sunroom unless we are Jeep riding. FM is spotty and fuzzy, but she sometimes uses her phone to listen. We listen the majority of the other time to XM Radio via a Pioneer Airware (it's antique as well). The Aireware goes in and out because the antenna can't see the satellite very well due to limited placement options.

What we need... a receiver that has the A and B switches so we can listen to either or both pairs of speakers, Internet Radio... something we can tune in Bama football, which is about the only time we'll need it, and something that will play XM radio. Roon Ready won't hurt.

The speakers are to replace the B&W speakers that are on stands now. We can keep the stands and use bookshelf speakers or buy tower speakers. Preferably, some with less than 90dB sensitivity, unless there is a separate volume control for A&B. When both pairs are playing, we prefer the outside be a little louder than the inside, and the Klipsch Synergy SA3 speakers are spec'd at 94dB sensitivity.

These speakers are not played very loudly, so they can have low sensitivity with no issues. This is not critical listening by any means.

I want to nail down the receiver first, then I'll start looking at speakers.

We have 1 gig Internet speed and a robust network, which is wired and has Wi-Fi, so we are covered with the network.

The first receiver I came across is the Yamaha R-N600A - Amazon: http://rb.gy/6sbr5r

It uses Musicast app on a phone or tablet, which I don't think would be ideal. Having to rely on the app on a separate device to keep things connected wirelessly is unreliable, as evidenced by numerous bad reviews due to lost connections. If the receiver itself can connect to XM via a wired connection to the Internet, then we should be fine, but I don't understand Musicast well enough. Bottom line... we don't want to rely on a phone or tablet app to control the streaming or for connection to the streaming. We do not want to use Bluetooth either. I could be misunderstanding Musicast and how it works.

It uses the airable.Radio, a service of TuneIn, which has at least one Bama football station, 95.1 in Montgomery, Prattville, so we'd be covered there. It does NOT have HDMI out, so the UI will have to be all phone or tablet app.


Here's a Denon that has HEOS built-in for its streaming control - Amazon: https://rebrand.ly/8dsrvpi

It has A/B speaker selectors and XM. It also uses TuneIn for Internet Radio and is Roon tested. I don't know enough about HEOS to know if its built-in nature makes it more reliable. From what I can gather, it does not cast from an app, although you can use the app to set up the built-in HEOS on the receiver. It has HDMI, which I'm not sure would help with HEOS or not... may still have to have an app on a phone or tablet.

Musicast is rated 4.4 in the app store vs 3.8 for HEOS.

Does anyone use Musicast or HEOS in their receiver?

 

[JStewart]

A couple of Wiim amps?
Checks all your boxes I think.

 

[Sonnie Parker]

Those are pretty cool, but not really setup well for SiriusXM.

SiriusXM is not currently natively integrated. If there are any changes, we'll update it on our website.
In the meantime, if you use an iPhone, WiiM Mini and WiiM Pro support SiriusXM App via AirPlay and Bluetooth connection.
WiiM Pro also supports SiriusXM App connected via Chromecast; WiiM Mini does not support Chromecast.

It appears no matter which way I go, I'll need to have a small tablet for navigating the UI. HEOS streams directly to the receiver for everything we want to do, but we have to be able to control what it does.

 

[Sonnie Parker]

I'm reading reviews of these apps and it seems there are a LOT of people having to constantly reconnect. It seems the apps frequently lose connection with the devices.

Then again, it could just be bad networks. We have Access Points all over the house, and our WiFi is excellent, so it won't be from our network if we have issues.

 

[JStewart]

Those are pretty cool, but not really setup well for SiriusXM.

SiriusXM is not currently natively integrated. If there are any changes, we'll update it on our website.
In the meantime, if you use an iPhone, WiiM Mini and WiiM Pro support SiriusXM App via AirPlay and Bluetooth connection.
WiiM Pro also supports SiriusXM App connected via Chromecast; WiiM Mini does not support Chromecast.

It appears no matter which way I go, I'll need to have a small tablet for navigating the UI. HEOS streams directly to the receiver for everything we want to do, but we have to be able to control what it does.

If for only in the interest of exploring possibilities, I’ll throw out I’ve always found AirPlay reliable on any device I’ve tried it. Since a device/app is needed anyway, then airplay from the Sirius app should be fine.
There’s another alternative available with S/XM & Wiim products that applies to Amazon Alexa users.
The Wiim can be set up as an Alexa recognized speaker. S/XM can be connected an Alexa account. Once done just tell Alexa to play the channel name from “Sirius XM”. Wife is a crazy Eric Church fan so … “Alexa, play outsiders radio from Sirius XM“ works charm… for her.

 

[AJ Soundfield]

I'm reading reviews of these apps and it seems there are a LOT of people having to constantly reconnect.

Have you considered an mid level AVR like this YAMAHA RX-V4A ?
According to this, you may only need the phone for XM log in, but the navigation is down via the GUI on a monitor? Maybe a smallish one (13"?) connected to receiver just for GUI? The Zones appear to be be switched/adjusted independently, including volume.

 

[Sonnie Parker]

Yeah... it is pretty much between the Yamaha Musicast and the Denon Heos. I'm leaning towards the Heos. I ordered a couple of their Home One speakers and the 11" Galaxy tablet to see how it works and if it will be simple enough for Angie. If it is, then I'll order the 2-channel receiver with the A/B buttons. I got to thinking she likes to keep the TV on one of her channels with the volume down, or she'll have the game on with the volume down and listening to the radio, so having on-screen navigation probably isn't ideal. I believe we can keep the tablet plugged in and keep it on top of the receiver or next to it for easy access to change it to what she wants so she doesn't have to interrupt her phone.

 

[AJ Soundfield]

got to thinking she likes to keep the TV on one of her channels with the volume down, or she'll have the game on with the volume down and listening to the radio, so having on-screen navigation probably isn't ideal.

Cool, but wouldn't you only need the on screen to select the Bama game on the XM app?

 

[Sonnie Parker]

The Bama game is not on XM... it's on local radio stations, so we will use TuneIn for Internet radio to connect to that station. That would be thru an Android app. She uses XM mainly for the Classic Rock channel in the background and for the outdoor patio. But during the day, when she's gone, I'll probably use Roon if I'm goofing off inside.

 

[Sonnie Parker]

This will also give us a relatively easy way to have music throughout the house without having to install speakers in the ceiling in each room.

 

[Todd Anderson]

I've used and really like HEOS, Sonnie. It gets solid support from Denon with lots of tech updates. I don't think you can go wrong with it

 

[Sonnie Parker]

We used it at the gun shop for several years and streamed Pandora via a couple of HEOS 5 units. They sounded pretty good, firing one of them up against a wall on one end of the store. It got a lot of conversation about how it sounded like music was coming out of the entire wall. They were buggy, though. We would have to reset them about once a month. Sometimes, they wouldn't connect or would lose connection for no apparent reason. It could have been our network, as I'm sure it was not the best back then... 9-10 years ago.

I'm hoping it has improved, as I know our network here at home is in good shape.

It will come down to how easy will it be to make it work each time we want to use it.

 

[Sonnie Parker]

I started a separate thread for the HEOS experience: https://www.avnirvana.com/threads/heos-home-system.13956/

I'm going to see how it works for a few days and then likely order up that Denon 900H with built-in HEOS. Angie seems to like the HEOS idea just fine, and if it continues to work, it should be easy enough for her to manage.

Now... what speakers to get for the sunroom to replace the B&Ws. I guess it woudn't be the end of the world to keep them even if they are 30 years old... being they are low volume background music. They are 88dB, so might just be the ticket.

Below is a pic of the current setup. The Airware on top of the left speaker will be gone, the 1984 NAD FM Tuner on the top shelf will be gone (40 years old - wow - it was part of our first audio system), and the Denon AVR. May keep the CD player, although I'm not sure why since we have Plex and Roon with all our music loaded. Who buys CDs anymore anyway, right?

 

[Sonnie Parker]

Have you considered an mid level AVR like this YAMAHA RX-V4A ?
According to this, you may only need the phone for XM log in, but the navigation is down via the GUI on a monitor? Maybe a smallish one (13"?) connected to receiver just for GUI? The Zones appear to be be switched/adjusted independently, including volume.

This is giving me pause for thought about what I might need here. With a two-channel receiver, I won't be able to control the volume separately, hence the mentioning of the lower-sensitivity speakers for a lower volume. The Zone 2 on the Denon 900H is preout, so it would require another amp to be able to control the volume. It would be cheaper to buy a 5.1 channel receiver and use the internal amps for Zone 2, and be able to control the volume.

 

[phillihp23]

The HEOS AVR runs XM directly on the unit if you choose to. You input sign on and password. (One time and it remembers). Then use the AVR remote. Or you can control it through the HEOS app. on your phone.

The AvR can be Ethernet or wireless connection.

 

[AJ Soundfield]

It would be cheaper to buy a 5.1 channel receiver and use the internal amps for Zone 2, and be able to control the volume.

I would think and I now see you already have a monitor in there. So how do you get Tunein/Android app to Denon? Yamaha appears to use a different internet radio, Airable. Don't use any of that so unfamiliar.

 

[Sonnie Parker]

I would think and I now see you already have a monitor in there. So how do you get Tunein/Android app to Denon? Yamaha appears to use a different internet radio, Airable. Don't use any of that so unfamiliar.

The Android app is simply another means of controlling HEOS... the receiver or the tablet can be used. If we are out in the patio and not near the tablet, we can even use our phones to control HEOS. The only difference is the receiver has to be powered on, while the HEOS speakers are more or less always on. Like this morning, I pressed the Jazz station preset on the tablet and the two HEOS speakers started playing. With the Screen Alive app on the tablet, HEOS stays loaded and showing on the tablet for up to 24 hours. Only if we go out of town for a couple of days will it go into screensaver mode.

After giving it more thought, we don't want to have to turn on the monitor just to turn on HEOS. We are going to rearrange things in that room a little so that we can place the tablet on top of the right speaker permanently, to be our controller, so to speak, for the audio. I'm going to replace these B&W 610i speakers. After listening and inspecting them, the bass is lacking (only rated to 70Hz)... and the surrounds are warped/deformed. I want something that will sound good at low volumes and dig on down in that 35-40Hz range.

From looking around on the Internet (with caution in mind of course)... it appears TuneIn used to own Airable (from a 2019 Yamaha manual - The unit uses the airable.Radio service. airable is a service of Tune In GmbH). I'm not sure if they still do. My guess is they split at some point, because they now appear to be two separate companies. From what I could gather, Airable has 70,000 stations and TuneIn has 115,000 (30,000 US stations). I did not realize it, but we already get Airable with Roon, so we will have both. However, I was not able to find any of the Bama football network stations on Roon.

 

[AJ Soundfield]

Way too complicated for me I'm just a lowly speaker guy. Seems like you have options, perhaps the Denon being the best one, again maybe a mid level AVR where the Zone B is powered channels. I've got a Denon AVR-X4500H that was bought for Auro 3D, never got around to using the HEOS. I'll put on bucket list.

 

[Sonnie Parker]

We need some reasonably priced speakers that can play down to 35-40Hz and sound good at low volume. They will be connected to this Denon HEOS receiver.

Probably go with floor standing to make sure it has sufficient bass. Height needs to be in the 42" range with width around 11" or so to park the tablet on top comfortably (must be flat top).

 

[AJ Soundfield]

Define "reasonable". Unless you need high SPL, bookshelves can go that low at moderate volumes. Those new JBL Stage 2 speakers look pretty sharp with the white fronts and light wood finish. No clue on sound

 

[Sonnie Parker]

Less than $1500 shipped.

I was actually looking at the white Tekton Uruz... fits the size preference just right and would look good in there.

• 10″ Transducer
• 98dB 2.83V@1m sensitivity
• 8 Ohm design for optimum performance
• Frequency Response 30Hz-40kHz
• 200 Watts power handling
• Height 39″ (99.60 cm) x Width 12″ (30.48 cm) x Depth 13″ (33.02 cm)
• Call for custom colors.
• Weight 56 lbs.
• Manufactured in the USA

 

[Sonnie Parker]

The Zu Audio DW6 looks good, too... although it's a little over budget.

There is no upcharge for White Satin (it is not listed, but I talked to him, and they offer it).

12 x 12 x 36 inches
Bandwidth: 30 - 22k Hz [in-room average]
Sensitivity: 95 dB-SPL @ 2.8V, 39” [1.0m] from FRD face to mic [2π - 4π transition @ 200 Hz]
Impedance: 12 ohm nominal full spectrum Z-weighted, 8 ohm minimum
Wavefront: virtual point source from 12k Hz and down
Near Field Transition: 20” [50cm] (driver face to your nose on axis)
Max Input Power: 200 W program C-weighted
Max SPL: 118 dB-Z (slow)

I like the 10" full-range driver. I think a speaker like this will be less picky about our limited placement and off-axis listening.

 

[AJ Soundfield]

Yikes, from small bookshelves to large FS . No comment on those choices, preferences vary, just hope you have heard samples from each Co.
Also hope you're not buying into the myth that Lie efficiency is anecdotally "better at low volume".

 

[Sonnie Parker]

I've heard a couple of Tektons, but I can't remember hearing the Zu Audio speakers. However, they have a very generous 60-day return policy.

I don't know what "Lie efficiency" is, so I can't say I'm buying into it. I don't think I am because the only reason I am considering the floor-standing speakers is that I can get them as wide as I want (11-12"). I haven't found a bookshelf that is 11-12" wide. Do you know of one? I do believe most of them will have better deep bass response.

 

[AJ Soundfield]

I don't know what "Lie efficiency" is, so I can't say I'm buying into it. I don't think I am because the only reason I am considering the floor-standing speakers is that I can get them as wide as I want (11-12"). I haven't found a bookshelf that is 11-12" wide. Do you know of one? I do believe most of them will have better deep bass response.

The very oft claimed sensitivity that measures 6+ db lower in reality tests. Having high sensitivity in a passive speaker smaller than a fridge often assures no low bass. Having low bass makes speakers sound better at low volume because our hearing sensitivity of low bass is much also much lower. hence loudness contour on old receivers and Yamahas. None on Denon that I'm aware of, unfortunately.