Leaving solid state gear on all the time??

[Grayson Dere]

I've heard and read about many audiophiles that leave their equipment on all the time for its audible benefits. I recently came across an older article from PS Audio that explains some other benefits of this practice. Does anyone have differing thoughts on leaving solid state gear on 24/7?

"If you switch off the power to your equipment day in and day out it won’t last as long as simply leaving it powered on. Why? Because the inrush current to charge your power supply up takes its toll over time – while steady state power has no such problem. Your electronics take a small thrashing every time you plug and unplug them from the power. "

-Paul McGowan

Source: https://www.psaudio.com/pauls-posts/leave/

As a side question, has anyone actually left a solid state amp on without turning it off for more than 2 days and experienced night and day audible differences as opposed to listening after just an hour of warm-up time? I've tried this with my Class D amplifier and I can't tell if I'm just experiencing placebo effect...after 24 hours of leaving my amp on I think I'm hearing less harshness and more instrument clarity/separation. Am I crazy? : )

 

[NBPK402]

I have never heard any difference with Solid State amps,by leaving them on 24/7, but it might just be me.

 

[Grayson Dere]

I have never heard any difference with Solid State amps,by leaving them on 24/7, but it might just be me.

That's interesting...Thanks for you input, Negatron!

 

[Mark C Flick]

I leave my amp on all the time but not for any type of audio benefit. I do it to help reduce thermal cycling which should extend the life of most electronics.

 

[Ian Eales]

It depends on the amplifier whether or not leaving it on has an audible effect.
Some SS amps have elaborate thermal bias compensation and change little.
Others not so much.

I found that with my Class D NuPrime ST-10, about 15 minutes was all that was needed.
I also found with robust levels that after quite a while, it began to sound harsh driving 4Ω speakers.
How much of that was due to thermal speaker XOver change or the amp I did not determine. See The Fly in the Ointment...

If one wishes to reduce inrush, use a soft start.
If the amp has a toroidal transformer, a DC blocker could be advantageous.
ATL Audio makes a nice product and has soft starts, DC blockers and combinations.

I'm not sure that inrush current once per day or so - provided the circuitry is well engineered - is particularly detrimental.
We always hear of catastrophic failures, but seldom of the millions that function for decades.
I'm not aware of any test that ran one device continuously for 10 years and cycled another daily.
Stress tests seldom mimic the real world and are designed to find limits which should be, but are not always, avoided

 

[Randy L]

I have a couple of Marantz AVR's (SR-7012) - One in the livingroom and one in the bedroom. I turn on the livingroom AVR in the morning and leave it on all day as I tend to listen to it at several different times throughout the day. I do this to minimize thermal cycling and on\off stress. I also have an aftermarket cooling system sitting on the top of the unit to further lower it's temperatures. (AC Infinity).

And since the bedroom AVR doesn't get as much use as the livingroom unit, I physically switch the 2 units every 3 or 4 months or so. (Pretty crazy, hun?) ... I'm trying to even out their lifespan and their possible 'break-in' characteristics that may occur over time. - Who knows?

I probably don't need to do any of this, but it makes me feel better... The truth is that we will probably get 'upgrade-itis' long before the end of our equipment's lifespan anyway! - Sooo... Lol.

I know that we spend a lot of time and money on our stuff and we want to protect the longevity of our investments. That's a very natural response... But sometimes we just need to let go and trust the engineers. Most equipment will last for years no matter what we do to it.

Don't forget to enjoy the music.

 

[bamtron]

From an old electronics tech: have observed the phenomenon in old Mosfet analogue amps - it's caused by old power supply capacitors which have high internal resistance. This causes the voltage to drop and ripple voltage to be higher when cold. Makes the sound "fuzzy" and dull. Faulty capacitors caused by leaving it on for long periods!

There is a psyco - acoustic effect - where the longer you are away from loud noise, the better you can discern fine detail, so it can appear that the sound is getting better after time. I've also found the sound gets better after a good cup of coffee.

Re inrush current - all modern amplifiers have inrush limiting circuitry to prevent over - stressing the power supply. Leaving the amplifier on all the time has a major cost. All capacitors have a limited life (eg. a common spec. is 2000 hours @ 85C doubling for each 10 degree drop).

Re thermal cycling - if you have a modern class AB or class D amp, most of the heat generated is from getting an output, so leaving it switched on won't make any difference. Class A and valve amps are different.

From experience, the biggest cause of failure is the standby circuitry failing due to faulty capacitors. Turning off at the wall can make the amp (and TV and DVR etc) last many years longer.

Dave.

 

[Asere]

I've been told it's good to leave equipment on so it can break-in faster and therefore sound better with time. I think equipments needs to rest turned off from time to time. I personally would not leave any of my equipment on all the time unless it's designed to be on like a DVR or like my phono preamp Lounge Gold.

 

[NBPK402]

From experience, the biggest cause of failure is the standby circuitry failing due to faulty capacitors. Turning off at the wall can make the amp (and TV and DVR etc) last many years longer.

Dave.

What do you mean by turning off at the wall...use a switched outlet?

 

[bamtron]

What do you mean by turning off at the wall...use a switched outlet?

Yes - remove the mains power from your equipment when you are not going to use it for a few hours. The "standby" circuit (that the remote control activates to turn on/off the equipment) is very often the section that dies - it is running 24/7. Removing the mains power can mean the difference between functioning for 3 years and 10 years+. Same with TVs, DVRs and etc. My Sony 7.2 ch amp, TV, Blueray player, and DVR are all over 8 years old, working fine. I switch on at the wall late afternoon and switch off all before bed. One wall switch to power board.

If you leave your amplifier fully on continuously, don't be surprised when it fails after 3 years, taking out your speakers as well, setting off the smoke alarm if you are lucky. (This is what happened to a customer of mine). I've known this sequence to also set fire to curtains and thence causing major damage to a house.(report from a fireman I know).

 

[tesseract]

I used to leave my gear on 24/7. My Exposure 2010S integrated reccomends a 45 min. warm-up time.

I turn my stuff off, nowadays, unless I know it'll be used again before the end of the day.

 

[NBPK402]

Yes - remove the mains power from your equipment when you are not going to use it for a few hours. The "standby" circuit (that the remote control activates to turn on/off the equipment) is very often the section that dies - it is running 24/7. Removing the mains power can mean the difference between functioning for 3 years and 10 years+. Same with TVs, DVRs and etc. My Sony 7.2 ch amp, TV, Blueray player, and DVR are all over 8 years old, working fine. I switch on at the wall late afternoon and switch off all before bed. One wall switch to power board.

If you leave your amplifier fully on continuously, don't be surprised when it fails after 3 years, taking out your speakers as well, setting off the smoke alarm if you are lucky. (This is what happened to a customer of mine). I've known this sequence to also set fire to curtains and thence causing major damage to a house.(report from a fireman I know).

Thanks, I have been using Insteon Outdoor outlets to turn my equipment on and off, and was wo dering about longevity, now I know.

 

[Grayson Dere]

Yes - remove the mains power from your equipment when you are not going to use it for a few hours. The "standby" circuit (that the remote control activates to turn on/off the equipment) is very often the section that dies - it is running 24/7. Removing the mains power can mean the difference between functioning for 3 years and 10 years+. Same with TVs, DVRs and etc. My Sony 7.2 ch amp, TV, Blueray player, and DVR are all over 8 years old, working fine. I switch on at the wall late afternoon and switch off all before bed. One wall switch to power board.

If you leave your amplifier fully on continuously, don't be surprised when it fails after 3 years, taking out your speakers as well, setting off the smoke alarm if you are lucky. (This is what happened to a customer of mine). I've known this sequence to also set fire to curtains and thence causing major damage to a house.(report from a fireman I know).

Thanks for the advice, Bamtron! I didn't know about the failing "standby" circuit.

 

[Tonto]

My dad used computers in the Air Force. He said they were told to leave all electronics on 24/7 because they would last longer.

 

[Grayson Dere]

My dad used computers in the Air Force. He said they were told to leave all electronics on 24/7 because they would last longer.

Apparently I have much to learn about electronics and heat. Up until now I always thought leaving electronics in a heated/powered state would destroy its lifespan quicker than off/on over time.

 

[Randy L]

AVR's when left in standby mode still put off a little bit of heat. So they don't actually ever get cold... Their life expectancy is quite long barring any inherent defects. Turning them "off" doesn't really turn them off. It puts them in a low power state. So temperature change is less of an issue. And modern caps when new will last a very long time.

 

[bamtron]

Apparently I have much to learn about electronics and heat. Up until now I always thought leaving electronics in a heated/powered state would destroy its lifespan quicker than off/on over time.

I have quite a few very thick, expensive reference books regarding the above topics - thermal stress and fatigue, mean time to failure and etc., so a brief answer will not be a complete answer. However, just briefly, if you switch off your equipment at the mains when you aren't going to use it for a few hours, it will last much longer than not. Further, if the equipment has been well designed physically, thermal stress and fatigue won't be an issue for the foreseeable lifespan. Again, the main cause of failures are short circuiting the speaker leads (which usually causes catastrophic output transistor failure) and capacitor failure.
For Tonto - The main reason for leaving older computers on is that "boot - up" took 20 minutes and the hard disc drive got a massive workout. HDD's used to fail a lot, especially the boot sector. The military used to swap out monitors and terminals on a regular basis for reliability.
For Randy L., you are partly correct - all the receivers I've worked on in the last 20 years have 2 sections. A tiny one (consumes one to two watts), on all the time, that just has the control computer that monitors for remote control or front panel "On" button press. This section switches on a relay that then supplies mains power to the amplifier, etc. It also passes remote control functions to various other sections of the equipment.
The problem with capacitors is that manufacturers use the cheapest part they can to give a mean time to failure prediction of about 20 percent over the warranty if the equipment is left switched on. The capacitors used are not the latest, wonderful long-life parts - they often use a 40+ year old design.
I was going to be brief.....
Bamtron

 

[Randy L]

I have quite a few very thick, expensive reference books regarding the above topics - thermal stress and fatigue, mean time to failure and etc., so a brief answer will not be a complete answer. However, just briefly, if you switch off your equipment at the mains when you aren't going to use it for a few hours, it will last much longer than not. Further, if the equipment has been well designed physically, thermal stress and fatigue won't be an issue for the foreseeable lifespan. Again, the main cause of failures are short circuiting the speaker leads (which usually causes catastrophic output transistor failure) and capacitor failure.
For Tonto - The main reason for leaving older computers on is that "boot - up" took 20 minutes and the hard disc drive got a massive workout. HDD's used to fail a lot, especially the boot sector. The military used to swap out monitors and terminals on a regular basis for reliability.
For Randy L., you are partly correct - all the receivers I've worked on in the last 20 years have 2 sections. A tiny one (consumes one to two watts), on all the time, that just has the control computer that monitors for remote control or front panel "On" button press. This section switches on a relay that then supplies mains power to the amplifier, etc. It also passes remote control functions to various other sections of the equipment.
The problem with capacitors is that manufacturers use the cheapest part they can to give a mean time to failure prediction of about 20 percent over the warranty if the equipment is left switched on. The capacitors used are not the latest, wonderful long-life parts - they often use a 40+ year old design.
I was going to be brief.....
Bamtron

Thank you for clarifying....I really don't know that much about electronics, but in my situation I have a Marantz AVR upper level. They claim that it uses "high quality" audio caps (whatever that means) Not really sure if this makes a real difference in their longevity. Maybe it's true, maybe they're exaggerating, who knows. Lol...

 

[bamtron]

Haven't seen a Marantz amp for a long time, which probably means they are fairly reliable....
Bamtron

 

[David Allmon]

I left a 50 watt amp on for over a year and one of the electrolytics grew a huge lump on it. I was upset until I calculated that the thing was powered up over four times the life expectancy of the caps. Assuming they were good caps. I replaced them and added a power switch.

Dave

 

[JJGR]

I've heard and read about many audiophiles that leave their equipment on all the time for its audible benefits. I recently came across an older article from PS Audio that explains some other benefits of this practice. Does anyone have differing thoughts on leaving solid state gear on 24/7?

"If you switch off the power to your equipment day in and day out it won’t last as long as simply leaving it powered on. Why? Because the inrush current to charge your power supply up takes its toll over time – while steady state power has no such problem. Your electronics take a small thrashing every time you plug and unplug them from the power. "

-Paul McGowan


It is true that the inrush current can be hard on some components. Depending on the temperature inside your amp while it is running, the heat can shorten the lifespan of semiconductors and electrolytic capacitors. Which one will affect your equipment more is relative to its design. Perhaps the manufacturer would be better able to answer your question.

 

[Grayson Dere]

I left a 50 watt amp on for over a year and one of the electrolytics grew a huge lump on it. I was upset until I calculated that the thing was powered up over four times the life expectancy of the caps. Assuming they were good caps. I replaced them and added a power switch.

Dave

Wow! The amp was left on for 24/7 for a whole year? What prompted you to check inside the amp for damage?

 

[DonH57]

@bamtron is right. Mr. McGowan is wrong. Inrush current is controlled, especially in modern devices (e.g. in the past 20-30 years or so) as power supplies and regulators have nice soft-start circuits included. Components "wear out" due to heat and with applied voltage (and current) over time. There are many, many articles about component lifetime and reliability. Leaving them on all the time will drastically shorten their lifetime and raise your electric bill.

FWIWFM - Don (analog IC designer, MSEE, as if that matters or as if you had any way to verify it )