Bypassing MiniDSP for Mains

[Ice32]

I'm looking to use a minidsp to integrate my subs with my mains while bypassing the minidsp for the mains output. This is because the minidsp downsamples to 96khz to apply peq and dsp. I don't mind that for my subs but don't want it for my mains. I have a schitt sys and use it to switch between 2 inputs (my avr and my 2 channel preamp) but it only has 1 output. If I split each channel of the output, I could run one set to the minidsp and the other directly into my amps. Please correct me if I'm wrong. Also, would there be any signal loss or would the signal degrade in any way if I do this? Additionally, I know using 2 dsp systems (hqplayer would be the one for my mains) would introduce latency and additional delay but I think I can still time align the subs with the mains in REW. Is this something REW can do?

 

[Keith_W]

I'm looking to use a minidsp to integrate my subs with my mains while bypassing the minidsp for the mains output. This is because the minidsp downsamples to 96khz to apply peq and dsp. I don't mind that for my subs but don't want it for my mains. I have a schitt sys and use it to switch between 2 inputs (my avr and my 2 channel preamp) but it only has 1 output. If I split each channel of the output, I could run one set to the minidsp and the other directly into my amps. Please correct me if I'm wrong. Also, would there be any signal loss or would the signal degrade in any way if I do this? Additionally, I know using 2 dsp systems (hqplayer would be the one for my mains) would introduce latency and additional delay but I think I can still time align the subs with the mains in REW. Is this something REW can do?

If I understand you correctly, you want to do this:

Preamp out --> Y splitter 1 --> amp --> Mains
Preamp out --> Y splitter 2 --> MiniDSP --> Sub

The quick answer is, yes it will work. The longer answer is that it is a bad idea, for the following reasons:

1. MiniDSP's downsampling to 96kHz is likely to be inaudible. The difference is mostly in your head. You don't need anything more than 44.1kHz.
2. Main speakers usually need to be delayed to match the sub. If your mains are not controlled by your MiniDSP, you will have no way to do this. Remember that setting delays correctly will reduce summation errors between sub and mains.
3. You will not be able to high-pass your speakers if it bypasses your MiniDSP. You may or may not benefit from high-passing your speakers, all this depends on your system and your room.
4. Sometimes, PEQ's need to be placed on the main speakers for better bass integration. If your main speakers are not controlled by DSP, you can't do this.

REW can certainly do everything that you need. It's only a matter of choosing your workflow. There are some videos on Youtube by Obsessive-Compulsive Audiophile (OCA), or you could look at MiniDSP's website for a REW tutorial on how to do this.

If you have HQPlayer upstream of your MiniDSP, you could certainly use it to run two DSP's in series. That works, too. But it makes the filters more difficult to design. If this is your first time, I strongly recommend that you keep things as simple as possible. Getting one DSP right is hard enough for a beginner, let alone two which are in series.

 

[Ice32]

Thanks for confirming my suspicions. While I realize you're probably right about the downsampling being inaudible it is still something I'd like to try. OCA is dsp Jesus. I've been following him for years and gotten amazing results using his tutorials. I wouldn't think of trying this without him.

 

[ddude003]

You may also be able to power your Mains Amplifier with XLR and the MiniDSP to your Subs with the RCA out or vice versa...

Double check your Audio GD HE-1 MK2 Operators Manual to see if you can connect and run multiple power amplifiers simultaneously (such as using the RCA output for one amp and the XLR or ACSS output for another). Some Preamps do allow this...

 

[Keith_W]

Since I have gotten into DSP, I have lost all interest in electronics. In the past, I was a card carrying subjectivist. And it was really expensive. If you hear a problem, the usual subjectivist remedy is to get on an upgrade merry-go-round to try to fix it. I didn't know if it was a problem with the speaker, the room, or the electronics. The only way to find out was to swap out the component and re-listen. All that changed when I bought a microphone, tried REW, and implemented DSP.

At the push of a button, I can swap DSP profiles and the difference is vast and not always expected. Yesterday I had a couple of friends over. My speakers can go down to 20Hz, and I can set my subwoofers to augment the main speakers (i.e. no high pass on main speakers, low pass on subs only), or take over bass below 50Hz (i.e. HPF on mains, LPF on subs). Or I can have my speakers go down to 20Hz with no subs. All three profiles are equalized to be the same, but they sound remarkably different. The "augment" setting for me produces really "fat" sounding bass, and it produces an immersion that makes you forget you are in a listening room. With subs off, the soundstage seems to collapse.

I can also put in high shelf / low shelf filters at the push of a button.

All these differences are profound, and it will absolutely swamp any minor gain you might think you can get from using a different sampling rate. These are real, measurable differences detectable by ears and microphone. It's not something you need sensitive test equipment like an Audio Precision to detect. My rule is: if my RME interface can't measure that difference, then the difference will be inaudible. I don't need to know if the equipment under test is -10dB or -15dB to the RME. The RME is already inaudible and any improvement over that is irrelevant to me.

 

[ddude003]

I always wonder why some commenters fail to illuminate their "More" setting so we have a baseline from where their are coming from... @Keith_W where are you coming from...

 

[Keith_W]

I always wonder why some commenters fail to illuminate their "More" setting so we have a baseline from where their are coming from... @Keith_W where are you coming from...

What is a "More" setting?

Anyway I was trying to tell him that any difference between 48kHz and 96kHz will be swamped by the changes made by DSP.

 

[ddude003]

It appears at the bottom left side of each post when you fill out your Account Details... Your location (where are you coming from) and details about your kit (helpful information for the folks trying to help)...

And yes, depending on the various devices in the small signal chain and software methods used to create FIR filters and the convolver used, a lot of the audible differences between various frequencies (like 48kHz and 96kHz) magically disappear...

BTY my mains go down to 42Hz and I let them... I blend the sub at 55Hz and it goes on down to 20Hz... And FIR filters do the rest... Old Skool EQ emulations with color/mojo curves and tube/transformer saturation to taste...