By Todd Anderson on Jan 10, 2018 at 2:00 PM
  1. Todd Anderson

    Todd Anderson News Editor / Reviewer/ Senior Admin
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    Breaking News: Redbox Set to Begin 4K UHD Rentals

    [​IMG](January 10, 2018) Redbox has been a long-time friend to the ever shrinking disc hungry enthusiast market, despite stocking rental discs with stripped-down features and audio encodes that often fall short of retail quality. It also consistently offers one of the least expensive avenues to renting a film, and the quickest access to most new rentals on the market.

    Last night at the Digital Entertainment Group’s (DEG) CES 2018 evening get together, Redbox announced its prepared to begin stocking 4K Ultra HD Blu-ray discs in select markets. Information concerning specific markets was not shared, however Redbox indicated that its strongest Blu-ray markets would likely be selected.

    This is rather big news for 4K UHD movie fans, especially considering the average retail 4K UHD Blu-ray costs north of $20 at release. Rental pricing for 4K titles was not announced, nor was any indication that 4K rental discs might carry lower quality (i.e., not Atmos) audio.
     
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Comments

Discussion in 'AV Industry News' started by Todd Anderson, Jan 10, 2018.

    1. tripplej

      tripplej AV Enthusiast

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      This is big news. DVDs are not dead!
       
    2. Talley

      Talley Active Member

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      Huge news.

      I think 2018 is finally the year of the 4K. At the consumer level. 4K is here now... here to stay. Sub 1500 4K projectors... Never been as good of a time for 4K but for now.

      Now if the delivery services/internets can keep up lol. But honestly this Ultra HD rental is awesome news... really it is.

      Pricing prediction: $3.99
       
    3. Asere

      Asere AV Addict

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      Awesome news. This will make me upgrade to 4K much sooner I hope. I can tell my wife see honey dvd and blurays are dead lol.
       
    4. Talley

      Talley Active Member

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      Yup. Oppo 4k will be in my system within the next few months and then it's just a matter of finding a projector that will work out in my room with the throw/distance etc.

      By September I'll be 4K ready. I've already told the wife any movies we buy from here on out will be 4K.
       
    5. Asere

      Asere AV Addict

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      Me too I've been buying nothing but 4K. Some are more expensive then others but will cost more in the long run having to buy blurays and then having to repurchase in 4K at a later time.
       
    6. tripplej

      tripplej AV Enthusiast

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      Knowing my luck, once I go to 4K, everything will be moving on to 8K.. lol. :)
       
    7. Talley

      Talley Active Member

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      Summer of 2006 was the first bluray players and movie disc releases.

      Laserdisc: 1978
      CD Video: 1987
      DVD: 1995
      Blu-Ray: 2006
      4K UHD: 2016

      8K Prediction: 2030. The reason is 4K hits the limits on what 99% of people would need. I'm not saying it won't eventually happen... but I think a 12-14 year cycle on 4K to 8K would be a good reality.

      You first have to get 4K mainstream... on the TV front that has been doing well... then media players and those are readily available but we need $50 budget units to become available before it really bites. THEN you need gaming consoles to hit the market with 4K media... that will push the 4K market even more... THEN you need broadcast companies to be 4K exclusive and we are at least 4-5 years away for that maybe longer AND THEN you need the internet companies to come out with anything remotely capable of handling that kind of bandwidth.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultra-high-definition_television

      Right now 4K UHD broadcasting is at 35Mbps.... 8K is 90Mbps!!! Current 1080P transmission is 10Mbps! Right now most broadcast in HD is done at either 1080i or mostly 720P and is upconverted to 1080P. This is why 4K is becoming slow to be mainstream because of the raw data that has to be transmitted and the broadcast companies can't handle it 100%. They are scrambling just to offer "Some" capability. They are sending mostly 7-8Mbps through the waves... this is why a 1080P HD Bluray at 35-40Mbps looks so much better than broadcast.

      Here is a great link explaining how difficult transmitting 8K can be: https://www.extremetech.com/extreme...-a-48gbps-tv-signal-over-terrestrial-airwaves
       
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    8. tripplej

      tripplej AV Enthusiast

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      Good info. Thanks for the follow up. :)
       
    9. Todd Anderson

      Todd Anderson News Editor / Reviewer/ Senior Admin
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      8K is coming much more quickly than you think. The new HDMI 2.1 standard lays the ground work and establishes the pipeline. That standard will be fully rolled out by the end of 2018. Both Sony and Panasonic are scheduled to ship 8K TVs by 2020...and the Olympics in 2020 will be broadcast in 8K within Japan. Sony has already developed its first 8K chip (X1 Ultimate) that can process up to 10,000 Nits of brightness.

      On the face of it, 8K is relatively meaningless unless you're standing a foot or two away from a screen. But the vast improvements in peak brightness output and color gamut are true game changers, much like current iterations of HDR. I saw Sony's prototype 8K TV and it's picture quality (brightness and color) was simply jaw dropping.

      So, while true 8K broadcast isn't coming any time soon in the US, I think 8K systems will begin hitting the market over the next 3 years.
       
    10. tripplej

      tripplej AV Enthusiast

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      I am sure starting in 2019 and into 2020 with all the push toward the olympics, 8K will be more available and affordable.. Time for another upgrade in 2 years or so.. :)
       
    11. Talley

      Talley Active Member

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      8K movies are still 8-10 years out. Just with anything recording comes first. Arri and Red just barely released 8K cameras. 6K is the most common right now. The first movie shot in 8K was the guardian of the galaxy vol2 which was shot on a RED camera... filming of that movie started Feb 16' and wasn't till movies in production later that year and 17' that shot in 8K. Your right into there is alot of color science benefits to the higher resolution but one could easily come out with sensors at 4K that could do the same thing. The HDR standard is simply a function of the sensor dynamic range. Still the best camera of the best is at ~16.5 stops. Most SLR sensors will provide ~12.5 stops on average up to the best sensors around 15 stops. The cinema cameras are hitting 16-17ish. Human eye can resolve 20 stops.

      It starts at the sensor... you dont' get more dynamic range by shooting higher resolution. What you get typically is better color only when it's compressed down to smaller formats like 8K downsampled to 4K.

      Again... 8K may be coming more quickly but I'm talking about mainstream where discs standards are made, movies are being released in 8K disc formats, etc... We are still at LEAST 6 years away from anything being done on the media side.

      normally it takes a standard to become like 75% of the market before something new rolls in. https://www.grandviewresearch.com/industry-analysis/4k-tv-market Here is some industry predictions of the 4K market share. It'll be 2024-25 before 8K stuff hits the streets and will take till 2030 before the broadcasting people can catch up.

      we haven't even had broadcast companies catch up to the 4K... it'll take them another 4-5 years.
       
    12. JBrax

      JBrax Senior AV Addict
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      This is great news and just another 4K rental option for me. I’m very lucky that my local Family Video also rents 4K but it’s usually just one copy. Luckily, that one copy seems to always be available.
       
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    13. Todd Anderson

      Todd Anderson News Editor / Reviewer/ Senior Admin
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      Of course the technologies are technically mutually exclusive, but the industry will never sell them as such, and as of now, 4k is rather firmly tied into the HDMI 2.0a specification standards and the bandwidth that operates on. 8k will be packaged with advanced levels of brightness, etc. There’s no way that you’ll see 4k and 8k sets sold with comparable specs in other departments. Perhaps a small overlap, but it won’t stay that way for long.

      Sony claims their 8k protype is showing 10,000 nits, which maxes out the HDR spec. I saw it. It’s the best looking TV I’ve ever seen... bar none. It made their highly touted Z (which was the only TV capabable of over 1100 Nits during 2017) look washed and old. Limitations of HDR on the reproduction side, thus far, have been tied to processors and screen technologies. The industry is going to blow those issues up quickly.

      Don’t underestimate the industry’s drive to mine money from the consumer pockets... as for media, look at the number to 4k UHD discs that have been upconverted. They will make it, whether real or not.

      I forgot about Samsung and their QLED 8k TV. I believe they are claiming they will ship units before the end of this year, with the promise of a processor that can upconvert 4k to 8k. The process has started and won’t be long before before the very best models on the market will carry 8K resolution whether there’s true content or not.
       
    14. Todd Anderson

      Todd Anderson News Editor / Reviewer/ Senior Admin
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      I agree Jeff. Outside of Redbox, we have zero rental source in our area. I’m most curious to see why kind of discs are supplied to Redbox. Some of the stripped down Blu-ray discs are disappointing. I find it hard to believe that Hollywood will be willing to hand over the keys to the castle for 10x less the cost of buying. But, here’s to being pleasantly surprised!
       
    15. JBrax

      JBrax Senior AV Addict
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      First off 8K is DEFINITELY not 8-10 years out and I’d liquidate my assets right now to take that bet. You can argue source material, broadcast, and what have you but we’ll have displays that at the very least upconvert way before that. I’m all for it so sign me up!
       
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    16. bkeeler10

      bkeeler10 Active Member

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      Wow, I'm surprised Redbox decided to do this. I'm fortunate to have a local rental place that is staying up with the times and has been renting 4k discs for at least a year. And I can get a punch pass that makes my cost $1 each. But if it weren't for that, Redbox would be my only option. It's good to hear they will support the 4k format. And yay for physical disc, so we can continue to get the very best quality from the gear we pay so much to enjoy!
       
    17. Talley

      Talley Active Member

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      I said for mainstream. I would say that 2018 isn’t now the year of 4K.

      It will take 8-10 years before 8k becomes mainstream.

      Sheesh people I’m not arguing. I’m just stating facts.
       
    18. thrillcat

      thrillcat Active Member

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      Not sure how I missed this, must've gotten caught up in the tail end of the post-holiday/new-vehicle blur.

      Good to hear they're going to add UHD rentals, curious what the pricing ends up as. If they do go to $4, it will still be cheaper for me to go to my local Family Video and rent there...I don't have a UHD player, but I've been buying the discs as future-proofing, so it's pointless for me today, aside from there being another outlet for renting physical media.

      My local Family Video, has priced their UHD discs the same as standard Blu-ray, at $3.29/night for the newest releases, going to $2.99/3 nights after just a few weeks, so it's cheaper to rent BD at Redbox, but likely more to rent a UHD.
       
    19. Sonnie

      Sonnie Senior Admin
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      Awesome news... we have a bunch of these all around us. That is if the price is right.
       

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