Upmixing... where are we at now?

dlaloum

Member
Thread Starter
Joined
Oct 8, 2021
Messages
55
More  
Preamp, Processor or Receiver
Integra DTR 70.4
Main Amp
Integra DTR 70.4 / Crown XLS2500
Additional Amp
Quad 606
Computer Audio
HTPC with MediaMonkey
Front Speakers
Anthony Gallo Reference 3.1
Center Channel Speaker
Anthony Gallo Reference AV Center
Surround Speakers
PSB Alpha
Screen
Sony X90H
So, in the early days of surround, I had a Lexicon DC1 and then an MC1...

These used Logic7 which did a fantastic job of upmixing stereo Dolby Surround to 5.1 or 7.1 channels...

Then there was Dolby's own PLII - variable, but frequently OK ... varied dramatically with different implementations by different vendors

Now Dolby has deleted PLII, and released a new "Dolby Surround", meanwhile we have Harman with Logic16 replacing the old Lexicon Logic7, DTS with Neural surround upmixing, and there is a buzz around Auro 3D as an upmixer

So where are we at? What sounds good/best today?

What works best for Music (stereo)?

What works best for Movies (stereo to 5.1, or 7.2.4.... 5.1 to 7.2.4)?
 

wus

Member
Joined
Dec 23, 2020
Messages
52
More  
Preamp, Processor or Receiver
Windows 10 PC
Computer Audio
1: ESI Maya22USB and an iSEMcon EMX-7150 microphone for measurements; 2: LogiLink UA0099 USB Sound Card for music output;
Front Speakers
2 x JBL 305P MkII
I tried all 3 upmixers in my Denon AVR-X4500H with Stereo music when it was new (about 3 years ago). In most cases - maybe 90% - the Auro-3D upmixer ("Auro-Matic") sounded best to me. In some instances, DTS Neural:X sounded somewhat better. In no case did I like the sound when using the Dolby mode on stereo sources. In some instances, I also liked the "Matrix" mode offered by the AVR, although it is not touted an "upmixer" by Denon). Unfortunately I didn't write down which songs sounded better with which upmixer. But I did try quite extensively, for a while.

At first I was enthusiastic about listening to my fave music upmixed to 11.1 3D, but over time I realized that in many instances, the plain - original - 2 channel stereo sounds the most direct and precise. Still, some music does benefit from an upmix.

The X4500H also offers all a Multi Channel Stereo mode which is still "original" stereo, but played back equally through all speaker pairs. I found this to be great for party dancing as it gives a fully immersive feeling for everybody within the sound field of the 3D speaker arrangement.
 
Last edited:

VoidX

New Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2020
Messages
7
Location
Hungary
More  
Preamp, Processor or Receiver
Cavern
Main Amp
Crown XLS-202
Additional Amp
TPA3116D2 x3
DAC
ASUS Xonar U7 MKII
Universal / Blu-ray / CD Player
PC
Front Speakers
Klipsch R-15M
Center Channel Speaker
JBL 8340A
Surround Back Speakers
DIY
Front Height Speakers
Klipsch R-15M
Rear Height Speakers
DIY
Subwoofers
IMAX DSL-1D + 3x DIY
Video Display Device
Overmax Multipic 4.1
Screen
Blanket :)
Remote Control
Cavern Remote
For movies, almost everyone is choosing Auro-matic, it's the least intrusive, but it means it has the least false overhead sounds. It basically throws the Auro algorithm on non-auro content.

For music, there is nothing that comes even close to Deezer's Spleeter. It's an instrument separation AI, but you can mix them spatially with a little work, and it sounds like it was mixed for 5.1/7.1 all along.
 

JStewart

Senior AV Addict
Supporter
Joined
Dec 5, 2017
Messages
2,040
Location
Central FL
For music, there is nothing that comes even close to Deezer's Spleeter. It's an instrument separation AI,

Maybe get a taste of that someday. For now it’s Auromatic for music and either that or DSU for movies.

but over time I realized that in many instances, the plain - original - 2 channel stereo sounds the most direct and precise. Still, some music does benefit from an upmix.

Same here.
I also find I enjoy an upmixer more with recordings of live music vs studio. The atmosphere it creates usually sounds/feels more correct.
 

Todd Anderson

Editor / Senior Admin
Staff member
Joined
Jan 20, 2017
Messages
9,141
Location
Balt/Wash Metro
More  
Preamp, Processor or Receiver
StormAudio ISP.24 MK2
Main Amp
Emotiva XPA-5
Additional Amp
Emotiva XPA Gen3 2.8 multichannel amp
Other Amp
Denon X8500H
Computer Audio
AudioEngine A2+
DAC
THX ONYX
Universal / Blu-ray / CD Player
Kaleidescape TERRA, OPPO UDP-203, Panasonic UB9000
Front Speakers
GoldenEar Technology Triton One.R
Center Channel Speaker
GoldenEar Technology SuperCenter Reference
Surround Speakers
SVS Ultra Surround
Surround Back Speakers
SVS Ultra Bookshelf
Front Height Speakers
SVS Prime Elevation x4 (Top Front, Top Mid-Front)
Rear Height Speakers
SVS Prime Elevation x4 (Top Middle, Top Rear)
Subwoofers
dual SVS SB16s + dual PSA XS30s
Other Speakers or Equipment
Behringer 1124p; Aura Bass Shaker Pros; SuperSub X
Video Display Device
JVC NX7
Screen
Seymour Screen Excellence, Enlightor NEO AT Screen
Streaming Equipment
iFi Audio Zen Blue
Streaming Subscriptions
Qobuz, TIDAL, Spotify, ROON
Other Equipment
LG Electronics 65-inch B6 OLED, Sony 65-inch X900F, ZeroSurge 8R15W x 2, ZeroSurge 2R15W x 2
I'd have to agree on the Auro upmixer, it's my go to for mixing legacy content. Highly recommend!
 
Top Bottom