How to measure headphones against a harman target as house curve

luizffgarcia

Registered
Thread Starter
Joined
Jul 27, 2022
Messages
17
Hey guys, i am looking for a tutorial on how to properly align my headphone measurements using a EARS device against a harman target as my house curve.

When i click the EQ button i can see my target and my headphone measurement, but i think i am missing some sort of conversion/compensation because they don't match even when i use an EQ preset which i know for a fact should put a specific pair exactly on the harman target.


1684764616440.png


The image above is an example of what i am talking about, oratory has a red and an orange line, one is raw and the other compensated, you can see that he can compare the orange one against harman but not the red one, i feel like i am comparing the red one when i try to do the same thing with REW.

I appreciate any advice.
 

luizffgarcia

Registered
Thread Starter
Joined
Jul 27, 2022
Messages
17
Here it how it looks on REW for me after oratory's EQ, it should match harman pretty closely but it is nothing like that:
1684781656102.png
 

John Mulcahy

REW Author
Joined
Apr 3, 2017
Messages
7,212
The red trace looks to be showing the difference between the raw measurement and the Harman curve. The appearance of the measurement you make with EARS will depend on which cal file you load for it. With the HEQ file you end up with the equivalent of the red trace as your measurement, the target is then to get a flat result after applying EQ.
 

luizffgarcia

Registered
Thread Starter
Joined
Jul 27, 2022
Messages
17
The red trace looks to be showing the difference between the raw measurement and the Harman curve. The appearance of the measurement you make with EARS will depend on which cal file you load for it. With the HEQ file you end up with the equivalent of the red trace as your measurement, the target is then to get a flat result after applying EQ.
Ok i think i follow part of what you explained.

Let me change my question a bit and maybe narrow down the answer so i can better understand. If you look at oratory's measurement after EQ you can see that it follows the harman low shelf perfectly, while in mine the bass is mostly a flat line even with his EQ settings.

Is that caused by my calibration file? I am using the ones provided by miniDSP based on my serial number.
 

John Mulcahy

REW Author
Joined
Apr 3, 2017
Messages
7,212
If you look at oratory's measurement after EQ you can see that it follows the harman low shelf perfectly
You are being a bit selective, the red oratory post-EQ line is largely flat. Your EARS measurements with an HEQ cal file are the equivalent of those red traces, they should not and are not meant to look like raw measurements. It would be worth reading the miniDSP headphone EQ application notes and EARS user manual.
 

luizffgarcia

Registered
Thread Starter
Joined
Jul 27, 2022
Messages
17
You are being a bit selective, the red oratory post-EQ line is largely flat. Your EARS measurements with an HEQ cal file are the equivalent of those red traces, they should not and are not meant to look like raw measurements. It would be worth reading the miniDSP headphone EQ application notes and EARS user manual.
I actually did but i lack the necessary knowledge about the entire thing to properly understand it all :(

So, my goal is to be able to put my measurements against the harman target which is my house curve, for that i would need raw measurements somehow? If so, how would i be able to produce that?

Sorry, i know my questions are kind of annoying since i am trying to achieve specific results without actually knowing what i am doing here, lol
 

John Mulcahy

REW Author
Joined
Apr 3, 2017
Messages
7,212
my goal is to be able to put my measurements against the harman target
You won't be able to do that, because the Harman curve is specific to the equipment and ear simulator used to measure it. MiniDSP's idea with the HEQ cal file is to produce the equivalent of a measurement that is corrected for the Harman target, so that a flat response means the Harman target is matched. They have done the work to make life easier for people wanting to apply EQ.

For more discussion on headphone measurement and EARS there is this and this.
 

luizffgarcia

Registered
Thread Starter
Joined
Jul 27, 2022
Messages
17
You won't be able to do that, because the Harman curve is specific to the equipment and ear simulator used to measure it. MiniDSP's idea with the HEQ cal file is to produce the equivalent of a measurement that is corrected for the Harman target, so that a flat response means the Harman target is matched. They have done the work to make life easier for people wanting to apply EQ.

For more discussion on headphone measurement and EARS there is this and this.
Oh nice!!! Thanks for pointing me in the correct direction, much appreciated!
 

AudiocRaver

Senior Reviewer
Staff member
Joined
Nov 21, 2016
Messages
974
Location
North Carolina, USA
More  
Preamp, Processor or Receiver
Onkyo TX-SR705 Receiver
Main Amp
Crown XLS 1502 DriveCore-2 (x2 as monoblock)
Additional Amp
Behringer A500 Reference Power Amplifier
Front Speakers
MartinLogan Electromotion ESL Electrostatic (x2)
Center Channel Speaker
Phantom Center
Surround Speakers
NSM Audio Model 5 2-Way (x2)
Subwoofers
JBL ES150P Powered Subwoofer (x2)
A lot of the HF variations with headphones result from ear resonances. If you flatten them all out, the overall result will most likely sound pretty horrible. You might try very gentle EQ in that range, just enough to correct for overall trends that you find objectionable.

Or ditch the Harmon Curve all together. They don't really know what they're doing.
 

luizffgarcia

Registered
Thread Starter
Joined
Jul 27, 2022
Messages
17
A lot of the HF variations with headphones result from ear resonances. If you flatten them all out, the overall result will most likely sound pretty horrible. You might try very gentle EQ in that range, just enough to correct for overall trends that you find objectionable.

Or ditch the Harmon Curve all together. They don't really know what they're doing.
The Harman target happens to match my preferences for sound, i never used it as a guideline. It was more about discovering that i can use that as a reference since it almost always makes my cans more to my liking.
In the end i use the EQ that sounds the best to me, but i use Harman as a starting point.
 

ddude003

AV Addict
Joined
Aug 13, 2017
Messages
1,403
Location
Somewhere Northeast of Kansas City Missouri
More  
Preamp, Processor or Receiver
PrimaLuna Dialogue Premium TubePre (2 channel+sub)
Main Amp
McIntosh MC152 SS Amp (2 channel)
Additional Amp
Yamaha RX-A850 Pro (the other 5 channels lol)
Computer Audio
MacBook Pro, Custom i7 7700k De-lid 2xAsus1080ti GFX Audirvana Studio, Hang Loose Convolver, Pulsar Massive & 8200, LiquidSonics, SoX
DAC
Chord Electronics Ltd. Qutest
Universal / Blu-ray / CD Player
Sony UBP-X700 /M Ultra HD 4K HDR & PS5
Front Speakers
Martin Logan ElectroMotion ESL
Center Channel Speaker
Martin Logan Motion C2
Surround Speakers
Martin Logan Motion 4
Surround Back Speakers
Martin Logan Motion 4 (yes, another set of these)
Subwoofers
Martin Logan Dynamo 700
Other Speakers or Equipment
Cifte 12AU7 NOS & Genalex Gold Lion Tubes in Pre
Video Display Device
Samsung The Premiere LSP7T UST Laser Projector
Screen
Elite Screens Aeon CLR3 0.8 Gain 103-inch
Remote Control
PrimaLuna, Lumin iApp, Samsung & Yamaha
Streaming Equipment
Netgear Nighthawk S8000 Streaming Switch, Lumin U1 Mini Streamer Transport
Streaming Subscriptions
QoBuz Studio Premier, Amazon Prime & Netflix
Other Equipment
ThrowRug, SaddleBlankets, WideBand & Bass Traps...
Last edited:
Top Bottom